#15 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Fogwall, I have a Condor 1 which I built from plans bought in 1957 and still have. They were bought from a little Model shop in AAchen Germany when I was in the RAF.
She is in my harbour to see. I did buy the fittings kit for her but otherwise she is scratch built all balsa and thin ply. Currently my oldest boat at 65 years old.

Roy

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#14 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Wow that was a trip down memory lane! I have several of the sets in the photos. I always and still do think the M series Futaba sets were the ultimate in design.

I have and use a Futaba 27Mhtz FM 6 ch. set, silver finish and it balances in the hand so well. Fleet copied the design and I have 2 of their sets.
Both were bought as 40Mhtz Plainsman sets one by me and the other a friend. Underneath is a label marked 35Mhtz!

I have a Skyleader and Micron which I built from the kit, it is so versatile inside with mixer, limit switching and a meter that measures signal o/p. It has a temporary fault which I keep meaning to fix!
Roy

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#13 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Thanks to Phil who I contacted via his site "Phil and Shauns Single Channel and Vintage R/C Page", I have been able to find some pictures of my first new radio control outfit, a 1966/7 Launch Link radio.

It may look like a simple black painted metal box, but when I first saw it in my local model shop window it stood-out against everything else with is shining gloss black enamelled metal case and the bright white Launch Link FLC logo.

The on/off toggle switch next to the top mounted output metre looks pretty basic these days, and the over-sized pointed lever to adjust the steering trim was also quite industrial.

I don't remember the servos being much good, and was the reason why I eventually sold it to buy my next new radio.

The choice was between the new OS Cougar or the new Futaba.....I chose the Futaba set with the 17M servos.

These days my first radio control outfit looks very basic and simple - but I would love to have another one now, working or not........or maybe even find one in good cosmetic condition and ask Phil to convert if for me to 2.4gig?

Bob.

https://www.mccrash-racing.co.uk/sc/propo.htm

Never too old to learn

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#12 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Phil,

Regarding peg boards - I really do know all about the problems of getting the pegs back from the previous user.

I started and run the local 1/8 scale rallycross club (for several years) every Sunday on our under-used pitch and putt course (with the full permission of the local council who were only too pleased to see somebody actually using it for something!).

By then, we also had 40 meg frequencies available as well as the 27 meg frequencies, so our peg board was considerably bigger and so we had a lot more pegs to offer.

We always ran 10 heats, and every heat had 10 cars in it, so we had 100 racers competing (plus several reserve drivers hoping that a driver that did have an entry would need to retire, so they could replace them!).

To turn around two qualifying heats and then start the knock-out finals with promotions for the top two drivers up to the next finals group took some slick organisation to finish the race meeting at a decent time!

Imagine the frustration when I could not start a heat because one (or more) drivers that should be in the race heat (that was being held on the start line) could not find the correct peg to clip on their tx ariels !

Finding the last user of the missing peg often caused drivers to "complement" each other quite vigorously as races were not permitted to start without all the drivers present (other than those with notified car or engine failures), and no driver was allowed on the drivers rostrum without the correct peg attached to his tx ariel .

Those were the days...................

What a relief it was when 2.4 gig radios became widely used - it made ornagising and running those busy race meetings so much easier !

Bob.

Never too old to learn

Liked by hermank and Steves-s

#11 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

That would be a MacGregor 27Mhz 1+1 for me in a disheartening and ill-fated model of the Turbinia in about 1973. The design specified 3 Orbit motors which were so electrically noisy they completely swamped the control signals making the equipment unusable. I still have however, my original R/C license.

Next was a Space Commander 27Mhz 4 Channel set installed in a Veron Titan Tug. This was much more successful and I used to share a pegboard at New Brighton with the Wallasey Model Boat Club in the late 70s/early 80s, though as a Liverpudlian I wasn’t a member. ESC was a home built ‘Pompey’ unit from the RCM&E design if anyone recalls it.

My inspiration however was a guy who used to sail scale model liners also at New Brighton in around 1970 with a MacGregor single channel set using a Graupner Kinematic escapement for motor and rudder control.

The 90s saw a Fleet 40 Mhz set in the Titan and many happy hours at Clapham Common and The Round Pond in Kensington Gardens.

And now I’ve regressed: This very afternoon saw me out at Eastbourne with a 27 Mhz MacGregor Digimac IV installed in a Graupner Condor 2. What more could a 70s teenager wish for? 🙄 🤭.

CB radio seems to be a thing of the past and the local sailing guys are all quite sensibly on 2.4 GHz so I remain unmolested, no pegboard needed, though I do still prominently display my frequency pennant as required.

It’s difficult to comprehend now how expensive this stuff was back in the day. 4 channel multi channel proportional gear would be over a thousand in today’s money. We have much to be thankful for.

I'm sure some will disagree, but I sometimes wish modern R/C gear looked a bit less toylike.

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#10 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Great idea, Roy.

I'd love to see the schematic you used if you've saved it; it's very interesting.

I didn't use transistors.
I connected the motor power supply (therefore, the ESC output) to the 6-volt relay coils.
I made sure the coil was energized only when the throttle lever (forward gear) was at full throttle.
To do this, I introduced voltage drops in the coil power circuit, but I didn't use resistors; I used diodes (I don't remember why I preferred diodes).
Only until the throttle lever was at full throttle did the motor draw power from the ESC.
When the coils energized, the relays opened the power circuit between the 6-volt battery and the ESC and closed the direct power circuit between the 12-volt battery and the motor.
This way (only with the throttle fully open) the ESC was bypassed and the motor drew power directly from the 12-volt battery.

What was the need for you to create a circuit like the one you mentioned, Roy? Why did you create such a circuit, i.e., why did you want to bypass the ESC and power the motor with a different battery?

Liked by hermank and jumpugly

#9 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Alessandro.
The o/p current to the motor also went to an emitter / base junction. There was a resistor there measured so that when the current was maximum the transistor would switch on and the current would call a relay. The relay contacts would short out the i/p to the esc and conect it directly to the motor.
I do not remember the actual circuit diagram as this was nearly 50 years ago.
Roy

Liked by Steves-s and jumpugly and

#8 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Roy, this sentence piqued my interest:
"I made special circuits that, when at full speed, a relay bypassed the ESC and applied the battery voltage directly to the motor."
In the first electrical setup for the Francesca, I also created a circuit that bypassed the ESC and powered the electric motor directly from the battery.
I've talked about it many times, including in the topic dedicated to the model itself.
I did it because I wanted the electric motor (24-volt brushed) to switch from 6 volts to 12 volts and because the cheap ESC I had available (Aliexpress and the like didn't exist yet) could only handle 8 volts.
I only had two channels available, and they were all occupied (one to control the ESC and one to control the rudder servo).
So, since I didn't have a command available to control any switch, I made the switch happen automatically when the throttle lever (forward gear of the motor) was at full throttle.
The system worked, but the transition was very sudden, and the speed was too high for a vessel of that type (with a displacement hull, it was unrealistic).
I managed to "smooth" the transition from ESC to battery, but then I removed everything. It was a playful experiment.
I preferred to use the space in the 12-volt battery to install additional 6-volt ones for more range.
I'm very curious to understand which method you used. Do you remember how you did it? Mine was very simple, to be honest.

Liked by Steves-s and jumpugly and

#7 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Phil,

Regarding peg boards - I really do know all about the problems of getting the pegs back from the previous user.

I started and run the local 1/8 scale rallycross club (for several years) every Sunday on our under-used pitch and putt course (with the full permission of the local council who were only too pleased to see somebody actually using it for something!).

By then, we also had 40 meg frequencies available as well as the 27 meg frequencies, so our peg board was considerably bigger and so we had a lot more pegs to offer.

We always ran 10 heats, and every heat had 10 cars in it, so we had 100 racers competing (plus several reserve drivers hoping that a driver that did have an entry would need to retire, so they could replace them!).

To turn around two qualifying rounds of heats and then start the knock-out finals with promotions for the top two drivers up to the next finals group took some slick organisation to finish the race meeting at a decent time!

Imagine the frustration when I could not start a heat because one (or more) drivers that should be in the race heat (that was being held on the start line) could not find the correct peg to clip on their tx ariels !

Finding the last user of the missing peg often caused drivers to "complement" each other quite vigorously as races were not permitted to start without all the drivers present (other than those with notified car or engine failures), and no driver was allowed on the drivers rostrum without the correct peg attached to his tx ariel .

Those were the days...................

What a relief it was when 2.4 gig radios became widely used - it made ornagising and running those busy race meetings so much easier !

Bob.

Never too old to learn

Liked by Steves-s and jumpugly and

#6 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Bob, I've only used 27 MHz radio controls for toys; I've never owned a professional or semi-professional 27 MHz one for dynamic RC modeling.
My first real radio control was a two-channel FS Fly Sky.
Then I bought a 9-channel Turnigy and I have two 6-channel radio controls of the same brand.
They're all 2.4 GHz.

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#5 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Funny you should mention reverse fitting the black crystals Roy.

I remember some model yacht sailors coming into our local model shop and telling me that they had doubled the number of 27meg frequencies that they use at the local lake by running one complete set of crystals in the correct way......making another set of frequencies available to those that reversed their crystals.

Their claim was that this allowed twice as many yachts to sail together !

Bob.

Never too old to learn

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#4 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Hi Bob I still have the club peg board somewhere in the garage. The difficult part was getting users to return the pegs. At the end of a session I had to go around and look at all the transmitters and get the pegs back!
I still use 27Mhtz together with the splits. Then there was 'black' which for some reason worked in reverse with the Tx. crystal going in the receiver and vice versa. Usually a guaranteed frequency until I met someone else with the same idea!
Roy

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#3 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

My first RC set is truly back in the dark ages, it used valves! ED Mk IV which sat on the ground with a hand held control box plugged in to it. The receiver was a reed one and to be honest it never really worked properly.

The first working one I had was from Derek Olley, (before he became Fleet) not proportional but using electronic equivalent of reeds and had a soldered in blue crystal. It worked very well, but very dear by todays prices.
Then along came Acoms and I have an original set with the original connectors.

At the time esc's were rare and expensive. Model Boats mag or the radio control derivative published a circuit called Pompey (slang for Portsmouth). I made this up and it fitted into a small tobacco tin. It worked fine but had 4 o/p transistors so for each direction of the motor there were 2 transistors. The transistor drops 0.7 volts between emmiter and base so you always lost 1.4 volts going to the motor and on higher currents there was a lot of heat to be dissipated in the esc. Some will remember OC29s and OC35s, I still have some unused ones if anyone needs them.

Hence the large heat sinks of early esc's. I made special circuits that when at full speed a relay by-passed the esc and applied the battery voltage direct to the motor.

Enough for now.
Roy

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#2 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

The first radio set I had I don't believe it even had crystals. It was just a large black box with two silver toggle switches and a telescopic aerial. I had to get a government radio licence to operate it legally. I think the license was 17s 6d. What category would this radio control set fall into? Pre crystal. I know I had to check around to make sure no one else was doing r/c.
🤣

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#1 7 months ago

Early Radio Control Experiences

Launch Link.

My first radio control was a 2 channel proportional radio set made in the UK by Flight Link.

Most of the radio control made by this company was intended for use on model aircraft, but they were one of the few (possibly the only one?) that made a two channel set aimed at the model boater and they called it LAUNCH LINK.

Radio control systems were MUCH more expensive to buy back in the 1960's when compared to the average wage.

I had just started work as an apprentice and had to save up for weeks to be able to buy my first radio control system.

My Launch Link radio control system was a two stick unit and had a black enamelled metal transmitter case with the Launch Link logo proudly painted on it in white.

Radio control systems back then used the 27 meg frequency and had a choice of different crystals that could be plugged-in to give a (limited) choice of frequencies to run on.

By plugging a matching crystal into the transmitter and the receiver it was possible to avoid intereferring anyone else who may be operating on the same frequency, so one of the first accessories that had to be bought was at least one spare set of crystals with a different frequency to the one that came with the radio set.

Clubs used to have a "peg board" with the different frequency colours painted on it, and each one had a wooden clothes plug clipped to it with the name (colour) of the frequency on it.

Anyone who wanted to switch on and run their model should go to the peg board and clip the appropriate peg onto the transmitter aerial before switching on.

Well supported clubs usually had a que of people wait for the current user of the peg they were waiting for to finish their run so they could switch-off and hand the peg over for somebody else to use and run their model.

This system did not always run smoothly (!) but it was the only method used - when there was any form of control available at the chosen location.

More often it was a case of walking around and asking anyone else that was already there with a radio what frequency they were using and negotiate a "time share" if it was not possible for either user to find an alternative set of crystals to use. These negotiations did not always run smoothly either (!) as they relied on the good nature and mood of the other user at the time.

Bob.

Never too old to learn

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Early Radio Control Experiences

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