Excellent product advice, jb, thanks. I wouldn't normally use International as their paint is utter crap, but you seem impressed by Everdure.

Cheers,
Martin

We have a product here Peter which is almost the same thing. A common brand is International Everdure which is a sealer and preservative used inside wooden boats. It is a very thin epoxy resin with anti mould properties which you mix 1:1 with the hardener. You can just make a batch and pour it into your hull and tip it around to get it in all the spaces ( hull needs to be reasonably sealed before doing this as it will find its' way out like water).
You can work it for about 6 hrs on cold days and brush any spots you have missed with what goes to the bottom. The remainder settles to the bottom of the hull and makes the keel like a rock, (you can remove excess with a brush and paper towels if you don't like that idea. The beauty of this epoxy is that it finishes as smooth as a babys' bum and you can even coat the decks with it as well (did the deck of my ST and you would think it's varnish)
Another brand we have is Norski which is the same sort of product. Reasonably expensive but magic stuff (smells strong for a few days then nothing, smooths out nicely too)
John B

The EeZeBilt technique was designed to enable someone to build a (small) boat without a board - just holding the parts in your hands. So it uses an interlocking set of cross-pieces. These make a stiff self-jigging unit which you just skin with balsa. You will see how it develops...

Hi DG,
I will admit it was tricky when I made this model. I had the added problem of the bulkheads moving, I first made the keel and attached the bulkheads to it.
I cut out the middle of the bulkheads therefore it made it a bit more flimsy, as I was making it for RC.
Then when the deck was fitted the tops of the bulkheads were removed at the openings.
The bulkheads were 2mm thick.
The keel I think was 4mm thick.
And the skin was 1mm thick.

The funnel and mast looks much better.

Martin555.

Well, if we have finished discussing ladies' underwear, I would like to go on with the discussion on plan creation...

Actually, paint finishes on EeZeBilts is a bit of a problem. It's true that balsa is not a good surface to paint on, and a common trick has been to cover it - with tissue, brown paper, nylons or fibreglass - and then work on that. I have always found this to be a bit fiddly and time-consuming, and prefer to get a reasonable surface with sanding sealer, then use car spray paints and finish off with spray lacquer.

Remember to seal the inside as well - balsa can swell like anything if it absorbs water. I'm currently trying sprayed acrylic paints in an effort to lower the cost - they seem to work if well sealed..

Anyway, back to the design...


It turns out that this hull is not a simple one to convert to an EeZeBilt. The angles on it make the shape critical to get right, and we have no measurements or any precise pictures at right angles. Still, we will do our best...

Now we have got a basic hull shape, we look at it, compare with pictures and see if it looks right... When I did this, I thought that the stern should be fatter and the hull should taper towards the bow. Martin555 pointed out that the funnel should be lower and wider, and the mast should be wider... so I tweaked the hull and superstructure until it looked a bit closer... compare fig 10 with fig 11.

As we develop a reasonable plan and elevation, we can start to consider cross-sections. In this case I am thinking about powering the hull with water-jets, so I think about where they will fit. Most of the hull can be a simple box structure which the egg-box design is great for - it will only need a different approach at the bow. In fig 12 you can see various stern cross-sections being tried out for jet fitting and similarity to the rear photo. A CAD package is really handy here - you can just nudge lines and angles until they look OK.

When the hull shape looks like it's settled down, we can add the cross bulkheads. You can see these in fig 13. From this drawing we will be able to generate the bulkhead shapes, the deck and sub-deck and the keel, just by measurement. But only for the main part of the hull. We will leave the ways you can do EeZebilt bows for the next session...

Hi Martin 555 - think DG is the best person to answer your query - he has built many more EeZeBilts than I have. For my sons ones, simply used polyurethane paint on the hull as for full size dinghy's . Cant remember what for the superstructure - but did use satin type of varnish still available here for the pencil lined decks. Long ago (in the eighties) and memory not good in parts like the curates egg..............
The two finished modern ones are polyester coated - varnished inside only on the enclosed bits. Humbrol matt enamel to finish as it was on hand , sprayed clear satin varnish cover.

Believe it or not I have never made a boat using balsa Wood.
And as soon as I can I am going to try and design and build an EeZeBuilt boat.
I want to make it in the same way as they are already designed, looking at it as a beginner would do.
And as I just cannot get the hang of CAD I will have to draw it out by hand.
I have a few other things to do first.

Martin555.

The police boat used as my Avatar was built nearly 40 years ago from Mugongo - reinforced with polyester resin as described - it has stood moves around Africa, to England and back, made many trips to Europe from England and has sailed in many places in the UK, Africa and Europe.
Very similar to Balsa the hull and superstructure have stood the test of time and some very bad handling with only minor damage easily repaired.

Hi Red,
What is actually recommended for the EeZeBuilt models ?
Also for the inside of the hull to water proof it ?

Martin 555.

After all the comments and advice feel I have to chip in again - the best I have found over the years for Balsa or other light wood like African Mugongo was polyester resin thinned about 20 to 30%, it becomes a virtually watery liquid and soaks in well - just don't use too much hardener as the heat could be a problem. (Just enough for the original volume of resin). That forms a very hard skin on the balsa itself and if you want a stronger surface you can either use GF tissue/polyester or as we get locally a type of water proofing membrane - thinner than tissue paper - which when used used with aircraft dope gets really hard. (Never tried it with polyester resin as I suspect it might react and melt) In our young days we all used dope and tissue on aircraft - never tried on boats - not sure what the guardians of the nanny state would say about that now...........
Epoxy resin or the water based type might be the modern answer - especially as the water based one might well soak in the same way - but some people have very bad reactions to epoxy ..........

Interesting. I don''t usually have anything to do with water based stuff, except arty paints, but where foam is concerned you have to be very careful.

Cheers,
Martin

Sorry guys another senior moment or is it the medication.

Martin 555.

Enough of the ribaldry Gents!
Think of the blood pressure!😮😮

😎

Hi Martin 555! (Too many Martins!?)
"I think that if I asked my wife to buy me some tights so that I could experiment I think I would be in trouble."
Go on, be adventurous, go for the matching bra and knickers while you're at it!! 😮😂🤣
Who knows what might transpire!!??
BTW: it was Martin WQ that mentioned experimenting not Colin😉
Cheers, Doug 😎

"Anyone know what Ezekote is made of?"
Whatever it is Martin it's water based, has no pong so you can use it indoors without getting moaned at 😊 and you can wash out the brushes easily with warm water👍
Doug😎

Borrow as in I'll replace them with new ones on next shopping trip. That's if I remembered to tell her that I had borrowed them. Amazing how well they cling to the curves of hulls, as well as legs.
Cheers Colin. 👍

Hi Colin,
"If I run out of glass cloth then I'll BORROW a pair of my wife's old tights, ..."
Oha! And what happens when she wants 'em back after the loan!!??😁
"... can be stretched to fit most shapes of ... !!"
Greetings to you both, cheers, Doug 😎
How's the Commander getting on?

Evenin' John,
"R/C planes are all about crashing ... On its' 3rd rebuild and still going strong."
Good for you 👍
I just thought that the Kirby was such an ugly bird anyway and rebuilding the Spit was job for a matchstick model fan🤔
Cheers, Doug😎

She knows I'll play with any likely material, John. I cut a lump out of her net curtains once to make model Rattan for a Riva cocktail cabinet. I would have asked, but she'd gawn shopp'n'.

Pegasus stock Koverall, so I might take a trip over there. It's not TOO far to go.

M

Just don't ask to try on one of her dresses Martin!!! - there'd be no thinking about it!! 😂
John B

DG, don't buy off Amazon, way too expensive! cheaper in UK I think.

WQ, You can use Sig Stix it as well which is brushed on and activated by heat.
John B

Wilco. Stuck at the pootah as my back's killing me for some reason ,so workbench is out for the evening and I rarely watch Telly.
Ta.

Martin

Hi Colin,
I think that if I asked my wife to buy me some tights so that I could experiment I think I would be in trouble.

Martin.

WQ, just type Sig Koverall UK into the google search box and it give you all the UK sellers, Quite common, been around probably since the 70s. Dont buy off Amazon, UK shops seem reasonably cheap
John B

Tights, hmm, I've heard of using them. Trouble is, my wife no longer wears them, but I dare say I could get her to buy a pair for me to experiment. Must be cheaper than £60 a sheet! And I must try Ezekote. Anyone know what Ezekote is made of?

Martin

Sorry for the intrusion, I use 0.03mm glass cloth on my balsa models, and also on lite ply ones. If I run out of glass cloth then I'll borrow a pair of my wife's old tights, works really well and can be stretched to fit most shapes of Hull. Both methods used with ezekote, give good results and are usually ready to re-coat or paint in less than an hour.
Cheers Colin.

Ouch! That's too much for me!
Oh well, back to Hobbyking or ebay.

Martin

Hi Doug, R/C planes are all about crashing (if you are not crashing, you're not trying hard enough,) as long as the pilot can walk away its a good landing!😁 My vintage 1975 (UK Saturn Models) Sky Dancer (ex IC now DC) has had more big hits than Elvis, but the pilot's survived them all without a scratch! On its' 3rd rebuild and still going strong.
John B

Koverall is doped onto the surface as you would tissue. You give the wing frame a coat of non-tautening thinnish dope (not tautening unless you want your frame to look like a pretzel) drape the Koverall over the wing (you can do it in one go right around the wing or do the bottoms first with an overlap at the leading edge, and the top surfaces coming down over the leading edge overlap) and brush the dope through the cloth onto the outer framing and sheeting-(not the rib caps,) keeping the fibers lined up down the wing and the cloth pulled as firmly as poss in all directions to remove creases.
You don't have to worry if it's very slightly baggy over the open sections, as once you start heating it it will shrink up tight (know when to stop as soon as it looks tight,) and has a drum sound when flicked). You can work any creases out by re doping to melt the previous dope and rubbing/pulling the crease/bubble to an outside edge. allow to dry (only needs a few minutes) then apply a few more coats of dope over the cloth till it's sealed.
You will need to really seal the cut edges as when you light sand it later (600 paper -you don't want to go through the covering) you will find they feather up. (I have found that with any problem edges, I just run thin cyno along the edge which hardens it up for sanding) Once happy you can undercoat it with acrylic primer/filler, and topcoat it with an acrylic or enamel finish. As mentioned, you can use this cloth for anything which requires a thin tough durable covering, (I even use it for hatch hinges on boats and planes,- doped on and painted over)
If you have something large like a plane, you will need a reasonable quantity of dope, but the beauty of this stuff is that even if you run out 3/4 way through, you just re dope/melt where you left off and carry on. You can also brush the dope with acetone to melt it as well. Once you get the hang of it, it's a piece of cake and very authentic looking (especially on planes etc).
Probably compares cost wise to covering with Solarfilm or similar (think they are NZ $60-$80+ a roll) the Sig Koverite cost me about $20 for a 6ft x 5ft sheet (there are various sizes) plus $45 for a quart of proper aircraft non tautening dope (average 48" plane would only use around 300-500ml including doping the balsa fuselage, just bought the Quart because it was the smallest the aircraft supply shop had and it was 1/2 the price of the model shop, and the 'real stuff'). I might make a quick You Tube vid to show this stuff being applied, (or you can watch this lovely young lady applying the thicker similar polyester material to a full sized aircraft frame. )
Enjoy. John B

Hi John,
"Have you tried this material Doug?"
No John, no requirement these days. Otherwise I wouldn't have sold Martin the Cub at a bargain price😉
I too built some EzeBilt planes back then-
A Kirby Prefect glider - that flew like a lead brick,
A Spitfire - that flew quite well until it cartwheeled on landing and screwed itself into a ball 😠
My third attempt at an aircraft (after dreaming of the KK Hawker Hunter fitted with a Jetex!) was a self designed 6' span sailplane, made from three 36x4" 1/4" balsa sheets.
Launched on it's maiden flight from the top of the water tower at the then RAF Hemswell, it caught a thermal and spiralled lazily up and up - and away to the north east.
I often wonder if it made it to Norway!? After that - only boats and ships; I can swim - but not fly🤔
No idea now what the Simprop Zaunkönig was covered with, was 35 years ago!
But I do remember that it went on, using a ceramic sole travel iron, extremely easily and shrank so you could play bongos on the wings 😁 As you say "tuning"!
Cheers, Doug

Hi Martin,
"I have no experience of Ezekote "
Sorry but that was immediately apparent from your comments I'm afraid.
Also I wasn't talking about the relatively heavy and harder to work 'cloth' but the extremely light glass fibre tissue.
If you can brush on varnish or paint you can brush on Ezekote and tissue just as quick and easy. It dries in around 20 to 30 minutes, depending on ambient temperature and humidity.
I used this technique to stabilise the hull of the Billing Boats Danish Fish Cutter "Gina 2", see Blog on this site. Works a treat and is very easy and quick. No faff at all.
Work as you would for brush varnishing / painting and the flatting back is no worse.

Before painting I did a ballasting test and left it floating about in the bath (sorry Domestic test Tank 😉) for hours. No leaks or signs of external ingress.
BTW: the old Sea Scout that Dad built and I restored recently, was originally painted with JapLac. Never leaked as far as no know. But, when I came to renovate it although there were no signs of leaks visible on the inside, there was some evidence of flaking and delamination of the ply visible on the outside.

Cheers, Doug 😎

Hi Guys,
Has anyone coated balsa wood with thinned white wood glue ?
In the past I have had good results this way and it helps to strengthen it and is less prone to dents, a few coats and a light rub down.
Ideal for EeZeBuilt model boats.

Martin.

Looks quite available. £60+ for 5 yds - but I can't tell how wide it is...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SIG-Heat-Shrinkable-Koverall-Package/dp/B00CS2JP6S

John, tell us more about Koverall? I have never heard of it or even read of it on model aircraft forums, yet it sounds excellent. I can't quite see what holds it on unless you use their preparation called Stix it. Is this likely to be difficult to get in the UK?

Martin

I thought we were talking Ezebilt. Covering balsa with cloth and other preparations is not Eze. It's a royal faff. Much easier to just use a decent material in the first place like plywood.
I have foam aircraft that are immensely stiff and light. Far more so than balsa, although without that rather crude packing tape they get dented like balsa, but are far less brittle so take crashes more easily. But we were talking about what's easy to build for beginners and no kind of coating is as easy as a basic kit, but that model will break sooner rather than later. Doped tissue might work fairly easily as will cellulose sanding sealer. But that's still a faff and sanding sealer has become a very considerable cost.

Doug, when you mentioned FG, I understood it to be light cloth or tissue, but it needs to be soaked with another coating to make it useful. More faff. I have no experience of Ezekote although I have heard of it.
I covered my mahogany strip planked cutter in epoxy coated cloth, but it took a LOT of rubbing down. But a large heavy boat requires a certain toughness. My other boats are not covered in anything but paint, though they are epoxied internally to allow for water protection. made of plywood and squeegeed with epoxy (no cloth) they are then painted. My old boats of course, are just paint and have never leaked a drip in nearly 60 years, so I am still not convinced by this fashion for encapsulating everything. I fear it might be a cover for poor craftsmanship. I say that as IU rushed the cutter and there were indeed a few gaps, but I am not able to spend the time I used to on projects. If I want an end result I sometimes cheat to save a lot of time. I wanted a model of the boat I'd lived ion, not an exercise in yachtbuilding so I banged the strips on and then covered it. It is now like a rock of course and utterly waterproof for ever.

Martin

Have you tried this material Doug? far and away the best aircraft/general purpose covering you can use. It's a thinner version of the stuff they use on full sized aircraft and you can shrink it tight as a drum. Great puncture resistance as well (better than Solarfilm or any other plastic covering. Great for cabin tops/sides etc as well, (could even cover a hull with it, - just dope it, trim it and paint it) It's about all I use on planes as I got sick of expensive Solarfilm and others going slack in the sun (it's very stable and doesn't move)
Slightly heavier than plastic but a lot easier to apply and you don't need an iron, just dope, a hair dryer and a bit of practice at knowing when to stop shrinking. You can just go along your wing (for eg) and 'tune' each section by flicking it with your finger and heating where necessary. Bruddy marverus stuff.
John B

Nothing at all wrong with balsa WQuay, if you make your hull from balsa and glass it it will be bulletproof. Most of my hulls are made this way and have even survived quite hard collisions on the odd occasion. Foam is ok for wings but needs reinforcing (and sheeting) as it is very flexible and soft. I prefer built up wings covered with SIG 'Koverall' polyester cloth which is doped on and warmed to shrink, which makes a very strong wing. I've also used it on balsa fuselages to strengthen various areas.
Most of my wings have destroyed fuselages in the odd crashes due to the strength of materials (namely hardwood spars, balsa ribs and sheeting and Koverall cloth). I have a few foam cored wings which are balsa covered with balsa L/E and T/E and finished with Koverall and they are as tough as nails. You could also use this material to cover a balsa boat which would up the hull durability by 100%.
I had a 36" balsa deep v racing boat in the 70s which was covered with glass tissue, and was powered by an OS .40. Never had a problem with strength, bashing that off waves in the sea.
Balsa is your friend ( not to mention a renewable natural resource and is 100% biodegradable)
John B

Hi Martin,
The FG refers only to the very light glass tissue, which is completely inert. (FG doesn't automatically mean Epoxy Resin these days!) In future perhaps I'd better use the abbreviation GF for glass-fibre (NOT Girl Friend😉) instead?
The beauty of Ezekote is that it is not epoxy, does not need a heat generating hardener and is water based. Deluxe advertise it as 'Foam Safe', that's even printed on the bottles.😊

The Foam glue I recommended is also explicitly described as suitable for Depron, amongst others. That's why I mentioned it.
I've tried various Deluxe Materials products and they all perform 'as advertised' 😉
Cheers, Doug 😎
BTW Both products also dry crystal clear.

Can't use FG Doug as depron doesn't like Epoxy or polyester. Ezekote might work but what of the heat needed to stick it? Wouldn't that disagree with the foam? I've used vinyl sheet that gets put on cars and vans. When bending Depron you need something to stop it cracking, so packing tape is a favourite. As it is for strengthening the skin of moulded EPP foam models.

Martin

"On aircraft it seems people don't mind using covering material or even packing tape, but that would look naff on a boat! Not sure what the answer is really. "

Ezekote perhaps Martin?
https://deluxematerials.co.uk/collections/building-finishing-products/products/eze-kote
Maybe with some light FG tissue with the first application?
Cheers, Doug 😎

Hi Red,
Have a look at the Deluxe Materials Foam Glue-
https://deluxematerials.co.uk/collections/special-adhesives-for-foam-plastic

https://deluxematerials.co.uk/collections/special-adhesives-for-foam-plastic/products/foam-2-foam

SA distributor is
Redipak Wholesalers CC
Tel: +27 11 455 5990
Fax: +27 86 662 8613
Email: info@redipak.co.za
www.redipak.co.za

Cheers, Doug 😎

red,
I suppose you could use Depron for a boat, but it's not ideal as it would need a lot of bracing. I use UHU Por for gluing it, but hot glue gun stuff works if you don't mind spider's webs of glue strings everywhere. Just been gluing up a Skystreak wing by adding the skins in 3mm Depron. I buy it from SLEC who are a pleasant toodle away from me. We have home improvement stores that sell it in biggish amounts. It's intended for under laminate flooring as insulation. It's big problem is the surface. On aircraft it seems people don't mind using covering material or even packing tape, but that would look naff on a boat! Not sure what the answer is really.

Martin

Martin Westquay - wonder if an EeZeBilt could be made of Depron as DG suggested - that should overcome your problem with Balsa. Saw that it has been used for boats seem to recall by Ron Reese ? Covered it with stockings?

Local hobby shop had some Depron a couple of years back - thought about it and returned a week later to buy some - sold out and never restocked . Shop now closed and no idea where to obtain any here. What do you use to glue the stuff anyway - bought a pool noodle to make an easy rescue boat - cant find a glue locally that works on it. (know its a different material to Depron)

I am looking forward to it tremendously.

I have just been looking at the EeZeBuilt web site and I particularly like Neptune.
Will have to see if I can slot her in to my building list, the only snag is I don't have a printer so I will have to figure something out.


Martin.

"...After the drawings are completed I would love to see a build log on the build of it even if it is just to show the process from start to finish.. ...."

i started doing this purely as an indication of how I make up plans, with no particular aim of building a boat. Or even completing a plan set. The photos we had were not ideal for getting a close reproduction to your original. However, it is an unusual boat to model, and I might well take it all the way.

There will be decisions to be made along the path - at the moment I can't see how my current proposal to run the top edge of the angled hull straight up to the bow will turn out, for instance. And we talked about the power - I would like to try twin water jets, but they would be more complex than a single central prop... still, we can cover this and other issues as we come to them...

That is true. Maybe one alteration ought to be building them in a different material. Though they were never intended to be long-lasting boats - just introductions to start a beginner on his way to better things...

Having said that - here's a Terrier from 1961...

Hi DG,
After the drawings are completed I would love to see a build log on the build of it even if it is just to show the process from start to finish.

Martin.

It's the only way to make them knock proof, DG and is merely a case of doing exactly the same to the skins, twice.

M

"...I would think a good compromise would be to cover harder balsa with 1/64th" ply or even a cheap veneer. veneer can be had cheaply from ebay. Get steamed (Swiss) Pear and you have scale mahogany. .."

But makes the build complex and more expensive for a beginner.... An expert would probably work in a more solid wood from the start, or Depron. The Indians seem to favour Depron - maybe balsa is less available over there.

I had intended to do a 50+ model matching each of the original range - Beaver for Otter, etc. For the Cresta an obvious matching model is the Riva Aquarama. That's very popular, and will need your Swiss Pear...