#19 2 years ago

Rudders

Lew:
Yes, I also have seeing many tugs and push boats here in the Miami river.
I work for a display company here in Miami and we just finished working with the West Plam Beach Boat Shot.
Many of the huge barges where used as platform for the vendors and there is where we do our show booths set ups.
Here is a sample of our work. The Yacht Company is Northrop & Johnson.
😎

Liked by LewZ

#18 3 years ago

Rudders

Thanks Roy.

I understand that here in the US one can book a room on board some of the towboats. Here in west-central Florida, they only have smaller towboats, some handling the fuel barges bringing them to the cruise ships. Attached is a view of one of Tampa's towboats. My son took the photo from the deck of the cruise ship he was on (at dock).

An interesting fact about the towboats with z-drives is that the propellers only turn in one direction. The prop is designed for maximum efficiency in that direction. For example, to back up the drive is swung 180°. I assume that regular z-drive tugs do that as well. (Anyone know?)

Lew
Florida, USA

Lew
Florida, USA
Home page: https://www.RCFlorida.org/lmb

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#17 3 years ago

Rudders

Thanks Lew Z for that. I have been fascinated by the Towboats for years now, I believe some of the companies allow a day on a towboat as a visitor.

I have seen several documentaries showing the working life of the crew as the boats do not stop apart from destinations and locks.

I am sure it is a hard life but the access the whole country has to cheap transport of goods will keep it going for many many yers.

Roy

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#16 3 years ago

Rudders

Difference between an American towboat with two fixed Kort nozzles with six rudders (two steering and four flanking) and a towboat with two z-drives as far as the pilot house controls are concerned is in the photos attached.

Korts and six rudders: rudder/throttle lever controls (first photo).
Z-drives: Steering/throttle controls (second photo).

Lew
Florida, USA

Lew
Florida, USA
Home page: https://www.RCFlorida.org/lmb

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#15 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi Mike,
That is the picture of the one I built following the instructions.
Yes, I used it and it is still installed on the "springer" in my avatar.
It works very well in the squared off form.
I am not sure about a round tube. In my mind the
water would flow around a tube much smoother and not cause
the same amount of deflection as a square edge.
Barry

Liked by Mike Stoney

#14 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi Barry,
I wonder if a round profile would be better than a square one?
What is the effect of the square?
Have you already had experience with it?
Hobbyist greetings Michel-C

if you don't ask, you won't get an answer!

#13 3 years ago

Rudders

Roy,
Not my original idea. As I recall some time back it was on the RC Groups Springer thread.
I tried it back then and it works surprisingly well for slow tugs.
The picture is of when I actually set up the first one for trial in a Springer.
Barry

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#12 3 years ago

Rudders

Very similar to the Schilling rudder idea, which improved low rev manoeuvrability.

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#11 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi not sure how that improves things? Where did the idea come from?
Roy

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#10 3 years ago

Rudders

Roy, That is a lot of rudders!
I don't know if you have tried this but I have found it works very
well for maneuverability. By soldering on a square brass tube
on the rear of the rudder it certainly helps.
I will attach a picture for your inspection.
Barry

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#9 3 years ago

Rudders

Interesting discussion on towboat rudders. I'm glad Towboat Joe's website is still up and running. I got Joe's CD years ago, lots of drawings and info.
I used this to scratch build my towboat. In my case I ran all six (steering and flanking) rudders at the same time. The boat "turns on a dime".
I was planning on building a new towboat using the Graupner z-drives that I have. I was on a phone call with the captain of the MV Arne Christiansen and he told me how much better control had with the z-drives.
Lew
Florida, USA
https://www.marinelink.com/news/delivers-pushboat-steiner331898

Lew
Florida, USA
Home page: https://www.RCFlorida.org/lmb

Liked by Mike Stoney and Colin H and

#8 3 years ago

Rudders

Hello Roy,
I searched for it on the internet and found it.
Cool part! Thanks for the tip.
Michel-C

if you don't ask, you won't get an answer!

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#7 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi all the view from below. I made all of what you see except for prop and shaft. Took me a few days and the Korts contain parts for supporting the shafts.
If you had all left or right set of rudders working together you can see that going in either direction there will be an obstruction on the inward end of the water.

You can buy the underwater parts separately at an eye watering price, so I made them my self.

There is a Kort type propeller fitted, I later learned from Towboat Joe (now deceased) that that is what they used to do full size.

But there are rather a lot of logs on the rivers and they jam the props in the Kort nozzles. So ordinary curved blade props were substituted and these chew up any logs that try to go through the Korts.
regards
Roy

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#6 3 years ago

Rudders

The clue is in the first paragraph. Towboat! As seen on the Mississippi they are very complex underneath. The large boats have 2 very large engines. I will post some more pictures.

The boats by the way, are operated by the captain sitting between two large arms / levers. Quite different to what might have been done if in the UK.

If you google 'American Beauty' you will get some info.
The kit is from Dumas, but there is an excellent drone video of the actual boat running on the net. I believe they are the cheapest transport per ton anywhere!

The kit is back on sale again, unless things have improved the wood content is rather poor.
regards
Roy

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#5 3 years ago

Rudders

Hey Boatshed,
scratching your head is dangerous and accelerates hair loss!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Greets, Michel-C

if you don't ask, you won't get an answer!

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#4 3 years ago

Rudders

At the moment I'm scratching my head. I don't understand the setup with the rudders. I have never seen 2 sets of rudders on a boat and as to why? Shurley 🤔they act against each other? But then I am only ever into fast power boats and the odd slow recovery boat.

BOATSHED

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#3 3 years ago

Rudders

I will see what I can do.
Roy

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#2 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi Roy,
Can you take a photo from below?
That's how I can imagine it. thank you.
Greets Michel-C

if you don't ask, you won't get an answer!

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#1 3 years ago

Rudders

Hi all rudders are often neglected items, thought you might like to see a model towboat I work on now and again.
6 rudders in all and the 2 props work in fixed Kort nozzles.

I have separated the 2 sets of rudders as the ones at the top of the picture are only used for reverse. These are controlled from the sideways stick of the throttle when in reverse. The right hand stick has the forward direction rudders, as per usual.

I had several ideas on the system but this seems the simplest one. On the old 'Towboat Joe' website he has many options and I first of all went for the separation into 2 groups of 3.

But the towboat I have is too large a prototype for this kind of control, which is more useful in the handling of the barges.
Lots of soldering and cutting of brass sheet which was soldered onto ready made Meccano collars and using their Allen key bolts to secure.

Regards
Roy

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